Wolf v500, EMS 8860

[Cobber]

Has anyone used the wolf V500 ECU or the EMS 8860?

Feedback on the following.
Ease of tuning, set up, after sales service etc

M90 supercharged standard 1uz 7 - 9 psi boost is what it will be going on. I would also like to loose the distributors eventuly.

Any feedback appreciated.

http://wolfems.cart.net.au/details/635751.html

http://www.enginemanagementsystem.com/prod01.htm

 

[jordys ski boat]

hi there
the wolf v500 is hard to beat the new software has good data loging and 3d graphs
8 inj 8 ing drivers
and a better noise filter for the stock 1uz cam and crank sensors ref/sync triggering
and very easy to wire up

 

[Cobber]

Thanks Jordy,

I'm trying to see where the catch is. It does look very good value. Easy to wire will also be a big plus.

 

[Peewee]

Woah, that'll be a first for a Wolf.

I've never heard anyone praise a Wolf for its ability to happily read Toyota cam/crank sensors.


Look into Adaptronic, I think you'll find it creams the competition.

 

[Cobber]

Thanks Peewee, I will check them out.

 

[MaxPower]

The new firmware (4.72) for the wolf3dv4 has fixed my trigger problems with the toyota sensors, software fixes for what is really a hardware issue but seems to help alot. Fixed a few other drivability issues too. So i am halfway to praising the wolf triggers

The V500 is only very new and dont know of anyone with one running a 1UZ with it yet. Certainly looks the goods though, time will tell i guess.

I think the adaptronic is good value for the price market it is in, but the features are pretty much the same as any ECU of the $1000-1500 market. The only two extras are the knock sensing and adaptive fuel strategy, which are nice. The biggest downside to it is the three ignition drivers, cant go wasted spark on a 8cyl.

 

[jordys ski boat]

i have had no trigger problems with my triggering once itis set up right
trigger Degs 65.7 BTC
and i also use the trigger auto level witch swaps voltage during engine cranking from
low to high when the engine is running at 1000 rpm
i use the drivers side cam sensor
max does this sound similar to your setup
i do agree the wolf 3d v4 has poor triggering noise filters
i am thinking of going for a hall efect duel paulse trigger
this has a 5volt input once the ING is turned on

 

[MaxPower]

yep alsmost the same setup jordy, ref angle is slightly different but otherwise the same (have used both left and right cam sensors to prove both work ok). Dont use auto trigger but have tried it and works fine too. The problem i had was it would lose sync during cranking after a couple of engine revolutions, sync back up and then stay locked for as long as youd like to hold the starter for (obviously disabled fuel for this test). Think maybe a software problem coz it would do this everytime and with fuel enabled sometimes it would try to fire first, lose sync and then fire up - this was the part that annoyed me. PC software (in admin mode) showed a sync before expected error. All good now though.

The wolf V4 does not use adaptive zero crossing detectors which is why they are not so good at filtering noise. They now sell an addon box (similar to what Autronic sell for reluctor sensors) to do this, I built my own but still had the problem described above. Not sure what the V500 uses?

 

[jordys ski boat]

sounds like you had all the same problems
wolf sent me a reluctor interface to help with noise and it does not do a thing
i still get noise counts during cranking but all ways starts within 2nd eng rev
have you looked into hall effect sensors
a friend of mine had the same noise problem (ref/sunc) on a WRX
he used a hall effect with a duel paulse disk bolted to his crank
and fixed all his problems and it only $$ him 120$$

 

[Peewee]

The biggest downside to it is the three ignition drivers, cant go wasted spark on a 8cyl.

Indeed.

But if you were going to spend that much money on 4 ignitors (or a four channel ignitor) and either 8 coils, or 4 twinpost coils (assuming you purchase all new gear), then I doubt you'd be looking at the ~$1000 ecu market.

 

[MaxPower]

True. In Cobbers original post he did mention he'd like to go COP or wasted spark eventually. The Northstar V8 in the US uses a 4 coil wasted spark setup, the problem is it has a fairly complex trigger with dual CAS, however i have CAD files that could be modified to suit the 1UZ, they are pretty cheap (under $300 for everything needed) and provide a ref pulse to the ECU but require only a single EST signal for spark advance.

Just to hi-jack slightly more (sorry), Jordy I did consider hall effect sensors and found a source for around $30 a piece delivered but they would need slight mods to the engine to make them fit - they would pretty much bolt in but sat about 5mm too far from the trigger teeth. Never went ahead with them though as i wanted to see if the new software fixed the problem. Experiment with some small ceramic capacitors accross both the cam and crank sensors, around 10nF does help.

 

[Cobber]

This is all good feedback,

I don't wan't to be playing around with sensors and reluctor interfaces etc. That would drive me mad. The sales people will tell you what you want to hear, that's why I value real life feedback from the end users.

And for a $1,000 ECU the Adaptronic does look to cream the others in that price range. Australian made as well.

I would love to see an 8 inj & Ign drivers model for around $1,500.

 

[Peewee]

Max, is there any reason why Cobber couldn't convert to using the Delco style ignition system, and then drive that from any aftermarket ecu with only one or two drivers?

I'm not sure if aftermarket ecu's can use the stock Delco ignition modules, but if they could surely he could use the LT5 Corvette DFI Coilpacks?
Should be able to get them fairly cheap off ebay USA ?

 

[MaxPower]

No reason why not, the only thing is the northstar stuff is cheap ($300 brand new) but the LT5 vette stuff is a more costly ($1500+ new and still reasonably pricey 2nd hand). Both will need crank sensor/trigger mods though. The LT5 setup is simpler using just a single CAS and dual pulse trigger.

ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/uploads/dis_lt5_dis2.jpg

ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/uploads/dis_lt5_dis.jpg

And the northstar setup is attached below



With both the ECU needs to control dwell, the ignition output must go high when dwell starts and low to fire the plugs, most ECUs allow either a rising or falling option.

Will still need to use one of the cam sensors so the ECU has a TDC reference to use sequential injection.

 

[Cobber]

Thanks Max,

Certainly some food for thought and an option that may be worth considering.

I have plenty of time to research the options as I'm not in rush, If this were the case I would just go and buy an Autronic or Motec unit. This would be the easy option but I wouldnt learn anything then.

 

[Cobber]

Adaptronic 8 injector unit is under development but will be at least a year away.

 

[1UZ-HZ]

It seems I'm stuck between the EMS and the Wolf....both seem to be able to do what I want. A couple of my friends have had EMS before which makes me want to go in that direction, but I don't know. Anyone got some hard facts on both???

 

[cribbj]

As you're probably aware, the 8860 is only one name for this very versatile ECU. It's being marketed by several organisations and directed at various platforms. For the Audi crowd, it's called the 034 EFI system, and here's a website devoted to it and other Audi upgrades:

http://www.034motorsport.com/index.php?cPath=22&osCsid=b80919d3f9d1f24bafc7cc039de78258

Here's also a forum that has been setup for users - you might find out some interesting info about the Audi version of this system:

http://www.motorgeek.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=2


AFAIK, this same box is being marketed by three different organisations and called three different things:

EMS8860: Marketed by the EMS crowd in Oz
034 EFI: Marketed by Jared S. on his website above (USA based)
Redline 422/822: Marketed by Redline Weber in California

Did I miss anyone?

 

[Cobber]

As you're probably aware, the 8860 is only one name for this very versatile ECU.

Nope I wasn't aware but that now gives me some more places to look.

Some feedback on the EMS Stinger 4 would give some indication of the 8860 ease of setup and programing.

 

[1UZ-HZ]

I've downloaded both of the ECU's software, the Wolf seems to be more user friendly, but I still like having the familiar setup of the EMS...damn I dunno!!! I'm still going to investigate this I don't want to spend close to $2000 on something that wont do what I want it to!