fastmotoute
New Member
has anyone tried this and is it worth it. is their much work involved. do you have to change retainers and what buckets to use. thanks
under bucket shim conversion 1uz
- Thread starter fastmotoute
- Start date
The 1UZFE EGR Delete Kit is available for sale here.
Not in aviation or race cars, and metric standards are well below imperial standards.
Seeing as the majority of the worlds hi tech items are manufactured in the USA and we buy most of our military hardware from the USA, it is surprising that our government has outlawed imperial dimensions.
To make matters worse, we have not really gone to metric sized items, we have just changed to a metric conversion, 1" tube is not 1" any more - it is 25.4mm ---- crazy!
I suppose I must be a bit crazy, as I mainly work with open wheel race cars.
But the valve gear would be the same for N.A engine..
Maybe bigger valves ?? For N.A application.. But with high rpm a switch to
shimless is better.. There is a big chance at high rpm of a shim popping out.. Possibly from valve float...
The o.p asked about shimless / under bucket conversion...
I've done it with two engines now.
As XR8TT points out, the Yaris shimless buckets work OK, and if you need more thickness than they can provide, you'll need to go to a retainer that is setup for SUB (shim under bucket), or specify cams that have a bigger base circle.
For the first engine I used the Yaris shimless buckets, and OEM 2UZ retainers, which are machined for 5.5mm valve stems. My engine builder remachined the retainers for 6.0mm stems and that solution worked fine, however he said the retainers really took a toll on his tooling. Going this way, we were able to use stock 2UZ shims.
The second engine was built with Yaris shimless buckets, but with aftermarket titanium RB26 retainers, and custom shims from Precision Shims there in Oz. The spring seats of these RB26 retainers are just a bit too big for the UZ valve springs, so they need to be turned down just a bit, or different springs sourced.
As XR8TT points out, the Yaris shimless buckets work OK, and if you need more thickness than they can provide, you'll need to go to a retainer that is setup for SUB (shim under bucket), or specify cams that have a bigger base circle.
For the first engine I used the Yaris shimless buckets, and OEM 2UZ retainers, which are machined for 5.5mm valve stems. My engine builder remachined the retainers for 6.0mm stems and that solution worked fine, however he said the retainers really took a toll on his tooling. Going this way, we were able to use stock 2UZ shims.
The second engine was built with Yaris shimless buckets, but with aftermarket titanium RB26 retainers, and custom shims from Precision Shims there in Oz. The spring seats of these RB26 retainers are just a bit too big for the UZ valve springs, so they need to be turned down just a bit, or different springs sourced.
fastmotoute
New Member
thanks for the replies. are you saying that the xr6t springs fit the titanium rb26 retainers without modification. and all fits under the yarris buckets. whwre would i get the retainers from. im running std cams.
In the US, both Manley and Supertech sell the RB26 Ti retainers. Manley's are setup for single springs, the Supertech for dual.
I've not seen or tried the XR6T springs on either of these retainers so I wouldn't know if they fit.
And probably neither Zuffen nor XR8TT have tried these retainers with their springs.
I can, however provide the dimensions of the retainer's spring seat, and Zuffen or XR8TT can probably measure the ID of their springs, and we can see if they'll work OK, together.
I've not seen or tried the XR6T springs on either of these retainers so I wouldn't know if they fit.
And probably neither Zuffen nor XR8TT have tried these retainers with their springs.
I can, however provide the dimensions of the retainer's spring seat, and Zuffen or XR8TT can probably measure the ID of their springs, and we can see if they'll work OK, together.
fastmotoute
New Member
it would be good to work this out as a direct bolt on conversion. as im sure lots of people would be intrested in getting rid of the std setup
Here are the pertinent dimensions for the retainers. First 2 pics are for the Supertech which takes double springs, 3rd pic is of the Manley.
Note, you can't simply use these dimensions in isolation, because while you can find beaucoup springs whose ID's will be fine, and these retainers will sit down on them just fine, the springs' OD's will be too large for the spring seats in the heads. That's when things get expensive.
So the trick is to find springs with good ID's and good OD's, plus a good seat pressure, and won't go into coil bind with higher lift cams. That narrows the selection down quickly.
The approach for my 2nd engine was to use a spring that met all the above criteria, except their ID's were a bit too small for the Manley retainers, so we milled that 0.761" dimension for the Manley down to 0.755", and we were golden.
Note, you can't simply use these dimensions in isolation, because while you can find beaucoup springs whose ID's will be fine, and these retainers will sit down on them just fine, the springs' OD's will be too large for the spring seats in the heads. That's when things get expensive.
So the trick is to find springs with good ID's and good OD's, plus a good seat pressure, and won't go into coil bind with higher lift cams. That narrows the selection down quickly.
The approach for my 2nd engine was to use a spring that met all the above criteria, except their ID's were a bit too small for the Manley retainers, so we milled that 0.761" dimension for the Manley down to 0.755", and we were golden.
Not in aviation or race cars, and metric standards are well below imperial standards.
Seeing as the majority of the worlds hi tech items are manufactured in the USA and we buy most of our military hardware from the USA, it is surprising that our government has outlawed imperial dimensions.
To make matters worse, we have not really gone to metric sized items, we have just changed to a metric conversion, 1" tube is not 1" any more - it is 25.4mm ---- crazy!
I suppose I must be a bit crazy, as I mainly work with open wheel race cars.
fastmotoute
New Member
thanks for the info. so cribbj did u just use std springs for the modified manley retainers. by the way when i check valve clearance i measure the clearance in thou and measure the shims in mm
I was surprised to find that the manufacturers of the springs and retainers used a mix of imperial and metric for their specifications, so I just stayed with imperial measurements (and the spring tester that I used was calibrated in inches and lb's.)
The springs that I found (readily available) were Honda springs for their high revving S2000 motor. Better seat pressure than stock, no binding problems with higher lift cams, and they fit the UZ head's spring seats. Lextreme's springs also fit and had good, but not excessive, seat pressure. Both these springs required the retainers to be milled slightly.
I have no idea what the XR6T springs' dimensions or specifications are, but they would be very good to know. Rod? XR8TT?
The springs that I found (readily available) were Honda springs for their high revving S2000 motor. Better seat pressure than stock, no binding problems with higher lift cams, and they fit the UZ head's spring seats. Lextreme's springs also fit and had good, but not excessive, seat pressure. Both these springs required the retainers to be milled slightly.
I have no idea what the XR6T springs' dimensions or specifications are, but they would be very good to know. Rod? XR8TT?
Anybody know if Toyota MR2 buckets are the same size - there seems to be a mob doing shimless buckets for those.
http://www.rossmachineracing.com/3sbucket.html
PC
http://www.rossmachineracing.com/3sbucket.html
PC
Paul, they're the same size. The Toyota dealers that most of us deal with here in the US prefer to sell the Yaris version of the buckets for availability reasons (actually I think they're the same P/N's as the MRS buckets)
Still only a range of 5.06mm to 5.95mm.
Still only a range of 5.06mm to 5.95mm.
XR8tt
Active Member
I just bought some springs off performance spings Australia with moly retainers..
http://www.performancesprings.com.au/index.html
Yep the NZ2 engine from Yaris .. I bought a head and sold head after taking buckets..
Then picked up another 16 from Pick and Pay...
http://www.performancesprings.com.au/index.html
Yep the NZ2 engine from Yaris .. I bought a head and sold head after taking buckets..
Then picked up another 16 from Pick and Pay...
I tell you what... I'm all messed up now after reading this post... could someone clean all this up and just list what is needed for big cams for N/A hp gains...
my head is spinning... lol
I would rather build an N/A motor then a turbo one. I know its more money... but for class rules, and I want the sound of a good reving V8!!!
my head is spinning... lolI would rather build an N/A motor then a turbo one. I know its more money... but for class rules, and I want the sound of a good reving V8!!!
XR8tt
Active Member
The motor I'm building is turbo yes..I tell you what... I'm all messed up now after reading this post... could someone clean all this up and just list what is needed for big cams for N/A hp gains...
I would rather build an N/A motor then a turbo one. I know its more money... but for class rules, and I want the sound of a good reving V8!!!
But the valve gear would be the same for N.A engine..
Maybe bigger valves ?? For N.A application.. But with high rpm a switch to
shimless is better.. There is a big chance at high rpm of a shim popping out.. Possibly from valve float...
The o.p asked about shimless / under bucket conversion...
Last edited:
XR8tt
Active Member
Has any one tried these springs..
502JZS ...
http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/par...rts/Engine/Valve_Springs_and_Retainers//13935
502JZS ...
http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/par...rts/Engine/Valve_Springs_and_Retainers//13935
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