1UZ-FE vs. 2JZ-GTE

The 1UZFE EGR Delete Kit is available for sale here.

Toysrme

Member
It comes up from time to time, so let's try to merge any useful information into one thread.

Explain why which is better with both untouched bottom ends VS fully built bottom ends. Provide dynos if possible comparing same turbo/psi, or same engine modifications.
To start

Weight:
1uzfe 450 lbs. 2jzgte = 594 lbs

Size:
1uz-fe smaller packaging than 2jz-gte.

Cost:
1uz-fe easily available everywhere under $1000usd used. 2jz-gte's, good luck with finding used engines, new ones very cost-prohibitive.

Reliability:
1uz-fe is arguably the most reliable production engine ever & is also used in both production boats, aircraft, and powerboat racing. (A testament to that fact). 2jz-gte's have no such following, or OEM confidence in applications demanding such a high reliability rate.

Displacement:
1uz-fe has not only a large displacement advantage, but can take advantage of this when driving turbines.
Lexus LS400/SC400 V8 1UZFE Turbo Selection – Lextreme

Power advantages from displacement:
[documents deleted] No 2000 bhp 2jz-gte's around?
 
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Show me a competive race car powered by a 1uz? These days 2JZ powered pro stock chasis cars are running 6.40's @ 220mph. The 1uz is a great engine, but it has a long way to go to unseat the mighty 2JZ from it's already tall pedestal.
Dyno sheets don't mean anything, especially "calculated ones".

just face it, 2JZ is KING
 
King 2jzgte

you are absolutely right, it will be hard for anyone to argue the point. You have witnessed it first hand and can appreciate it more than others.
pops
 
Hehehe, I don't think those of us from the 2JZ side are going to flame this thread "that" much. After all, we're here because we like the 1UZ and think it has some real potential. We're not here just to defend the 2JZ's honor, but having said that, a few points in the 2JZ's defense:

1uz-fe easily avalible everywhere under $1000usd used. 2jz-gte's, good luck with finding used engines, new ones very cost-prohibative.
Used 2JZ blocks are very common, while GTE heads can be a little tough to find, but there are now single turbo kits for the GE heads that help it perform nearly as well as a GTE. Finding 2JZ's is more a matter of knowing where to look, and being plugged in to the Supra network.

A BNIB 2JZ-GTE short block with full Toyota warranty can still be purchased for around $2K. This is one of the best bargains around in short blocks. They're so cheap, it's cost-prohibitive to rebuild a 2JZ, unless it's going to be "built" for massive horsepower.

1uz-fe is areguably the most reliable production engine ever & is also used in both production boats, aircraft, and powerboat racing. 2jz-gte's have no such following, or OEM confidance in applications demanding such a high reliability rate..
I think that reliability honor probably belongs to the SBC, but it really depends on what definition of reliability is being used.

2JZ-GTE's are most definitely used in speedboats as I've personally seen two of them.

1uz-fe has not only a large displacement advantage, but can take advantage of this when driving turbines.
http://www.lextreme.com/T67GTQ.html
Power advantages from displacement:
2000bhp 1uz-fe pdf1 2000bhp 1uz-fe pdf2 No 2000bhp 2jz-gte's around?
With due respect to David, I think the assumptions and predictions made from these 2JZ dyno runs in order to get the possible figures for a 1UZ are flawed. A 1UZ is not a 2JZ with two more cylinders and another liter of displacement. The chamber design of the 2JZ along with its 45 degree valve angles, the shape of the ports, the cam timing & lift, all contribute to make this a truly phenomenal motor, and the people getting 1500 RWHP out of it are testimonies to its capabilities, while the full potential of the 1UZ is yet to be seen. That's not to say these figures are not good goals to shoot for, and I think that was the crux of David's article.

As far as directly comparing the two motors, here's my take:

The 2JZ has a bullet proof bottom end, and its 7 main webs are massive for an underslung crankshaft motor design. This is to keep that long inline six crank from flexing and wiggling around too much. The only improvement to this design would have been a bedplate for the crank.

The 1UZ has its 6bolt mains to restrain the crank in an aluminum block that is more prone to flex than a cast iron one. Still it's a much shorter crank than the 2JZ and will not flex as much. It should be easier and cheaper to build a stroker crank for the 1UZ, than the 2JZ.

Piston squirters are a nice feature in the 2JZ-GTE block; it remains to be seen if they can be successfully added to the 1UZ.

Pistons are about equal in both motors, but we know the stock rods in the 2JZ will hold together at 650 BHP, 7000 RPM all day long. A few have ventured into 7500-8000 RPM territory, but most people go to aftermarket rods if they want to consistently run above 7000. No one knows the limits of the stock 1UZ rods, but the early style will probably go to 6500-7000 with ARP hardware. At least I'm betting they will, 'cause my rev limiter will be set to 7K :veryhappy

The 2JZ-GTE head flows well, even though it can use "some" improvement to squeeze the most out of it, as detailed by my good friend Lance Wolrab here: http://www.t04r.com/techarticle.php?id=5

The potential of the 1UZ head remains to be seen.

The 2JZ-GTE motor had a far more advanced ignition system in 1993 than any other Toyota/Lexus engine. It wasn't until 1998 that the 1UZ motor caught up with the 2JZ-GTE's DIS COP design.

The 2JZ-GTE also had fully sequential fuel injection in 1993, while most other Toyota/Lexus motors were still doing batch injection. The early 1UZ had a 4 group, batch injection system, and didn't get fully sequential injection until OBDII came along in 1996.

John
 
Both engines are solid and built very well from factory that is fact. The determining factor is which engine is more efficent and durable at stock? Which bare engine has more horsepower at stock? All engines can be altered to create more horsepower, even the IUZ..'s. All the auto museums in LA recongnise the IUZ's and not the 2JZ's as the leader in engines, I wonder why? You need to ask yourself why is their more IUZ's readily available for puchase in yards, ebay, etc..because they sold more? or they just are simply built last to last longer?...Probably both I would think....

The 2JZ's are easier to build why? I think mainly because the 2JZ's provided more room under the hood for build ups, and twin turbo's were basically already perfected in the TT Supra's and not the IUZ's... More efforts have always been made to build up the 2JZ's. In my opinion and others the Iuz..'s is still the more durable engine over time. I think more efforts need to me made to build the IUZ's.... Oh the heat is definetely coming now...I am here to make that effort....

In closing the IUZ is simply V8 POWER...6 cylinder engines are never better then 8 except for saving gas, ask 99% of the racing experts in the US and they will tell you the same. I rest my case....I still think the 2JZ's are awesome 6 bangers and are definetely easier to build up for track and race use then the IUZ..'s.

One other thing Americans have always fallen in love with the V8's. myself included. The torque, power and sound is always better in the larger engines and the Europeans have alway loved the smaller engines. Why? because that is what they are use too. If you notice there are not many V8 cars in Europe and Import countries in comparison to the US. Gas prices and driveable land space I believe are the contributing factors for that.
 
I love the 2jz and 1jz more so for its price but at the end of the day I like driving and the lighter the engine
the better I enjoy the experience specially if NA as I prefer response over bells and whistles.
The 2jz is definitely easier to work on than any v8 except perhaps the LS but everything has its place
and its great toyota built the best 6 and 8 the world has ever seeing for $ value.
 


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